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Post by elkmaster01 on Jul 17, 2009 19:42:15 GMT -6
I don't know what happened,,,,I just launched Moat-Gator(600 ESP) and all seemed fine. I hovered for about 20 seconds then put the nose down and headed off across the field. Then I lost control of it. The tail swung slowly,,,couldn't bring it back,,,the heli started decending but would not respond to the throttle. Seems like my receiver went dead. When it got about 5 feet off the ground, it just rolled and drove into the dirt. I think I had chopped the throttle but I was in Stnt 2 and the receiver started working at the last second and I had full negative pitch.
It happened so quick I'm not sure,,,,I tried to hit the throttle hold but I was too late.
Here's the weird part,,,,it did not damage any gears,,,it did not damage the main or feathering shaft. Here's my parts list;
Tail boom bent 45 degrees
Torque tube bend
One landing gear pipe busted
Main blades toast
One boom support rod busted
Canopy trashed but fixable
Flybar rod bent
The entire head('cept for flybar rod), main shaft and main gear are fine. The torque-tube gears are fine. All the electronics, servos and Rx all check out.
I have no idea why the heli stopped responding,,,which really bothers me,,,I HATE not knowing what happened so I don't know what to fix.
Any ideas? Just a radio glitch?
Anyway,,,we'll be up and flying tomorrow!
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fergie
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Post by fergie on Jul 17, 2009 20:18:39 GMT -6
oh man that sucks elk,
brown out maybe? were the batteries in you TX good?
did you have a soild light on your RX?
i know i've restarted my heli because my RX started flashing, instead of a soild light.
and i know that low batteries in my TX has caused me grief before, but i was able to catch it.
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Post by elkmaster01 on Jul 18, 2009 6:03:12 GMT -6
Well,,,I need to kick myself in the teeth. When I got to the crash site, I failed to look at the receiver,,,,,Spektrums have a 'brown-out' indicator--a slow flashing light. I didn't notice,,,,I was so freaked out I just ran up and turned it off. I had a solid light at take-off.
My Tx battery was fine,,I check it before I go flying. I suppose I better do a good range check before next flight,,,I had not done one in a while.
Good news--- all fixed ready to go!
Bad news---- it's raining today!
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19000rpm
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Post by 19000rpm on Jul 18, 2009 6:51:16 GMT -6
And I'm with you; I hate it when I can't figure what caused a crash. Kind of takes some of the fun out of flying for a while.
Lucky break on the damage Elk.
I've had a couple of instances of lost contact on DSM 1 and 2 spektrum systems. It's not something that can be fixed. If you think that's the cause get the system replaced because it's going to happen again.
At the very least I'd rebind the system and do a range test.
Happy landings
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Post by elkmaster01 on Jul 18, 2009 7:37:33 GMT -6
yes,,,good idea,,,,I'll re-bind it now! I may move the remote receiver too,,like,, put it on the boom.
Thx!!
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19000rpm
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Post by 19000rpm on Jul 18, 2009 9:00:34 GMT -6
Good idea to seperate primary and the remote Rx's as far away as you can Elk; putting each Rx in it's own environment. According to Horizon; the reason they have the remote is to reduce signal interference (they use the word "attenuate" in their manual  ) caused by metal and CF components on the aircraft. Happy landings |
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Post by elkmaster01 on Jul 18, 2009 13:33:43 GMT -6
Good idea to seperate primary and the remote Rx's as far away as you can Elk; putting each Rx in it's own environment. According to Horizon; the reason they have the remote is to reduce signal interference (they use the word "attenuate" in their manual ) caused by metal and CF components on the aircraft. Happy landings I'm down with dat!! ;D I re-bound my Rx and moved the remote Rx to the boom. The weather sucks today but I managed a test flight in my yard. Everything is perfect, hovered and trims where great,,,used the whole pack - 6 minutes. Barring any more electronic glitches, I'm good to go. Weather looks good for tomorrow! The nice thing about flying out in the goose field is they haven't cut hay yet,,,,nice long thick grass,,,,I'm sure that saved me a bunch of damage! And half the field is oats, when my cousin cuts the hay,,I have oats to crash in!! ;D |
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McKrackin
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Post by McKrackin on Jul 18, 2009 13:51:40 GMT -6
When did this thread start? You wrecked it and fixed it before I knew about it?  ?? Tough break Elk. Glad it's back up though. You know,a Helicommand can lock out controls.... They need reset every now and then. |
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Post by elkmaster01 on Jul 18, 2009 16:56:42 GMT -6
When did this thread start? You wrecked it and fixed it before I knew about it? ?? Tough break Elk. Glad it's back up though. You know,a Helicommand can lock out controls.... They need reset every now and then. By reset you mean , the set button for the HC to learn your tx neutral settings? A couple flights ago, when I powered it up I have a quick flashing green light and no response to controls. I re-initiated it and also hit the set button. What would cause the HC to lock everything out? Thats not good. I hooked up the my PC and ran thru the diagnosis and all is well. I also decreased the HC gain and increased the stick priority a little. It acted great today. Try this for me would you; power up your heli with HC on,,,,let is set a minute. Turn the HC off,,,,then tilt your heli about 45 degrees and hold it there and turn on the HC. Continue to hold it at 45 degrees. What does your swash do? On mine,,,,after I tilt it and turn the HC back on,,,,the swash makes a 'minor' correction but it is slow,,,,and if I continue to hold the tilt,,,the swash levels out quickly as if to hold that attitude. Doesn't sound like a very good 'parachute' if the HC just levels the swash at whatever attitude the heli is in. I would think the HC would try to level the heli no matter what attitude it is in when you turn it back on. Have you had the occasion to be flying with it off,,,,and then turn it on when doing a maneuver? One more thing,,,,,how do you mount your HC,,,you use the thick foam pad that came with it? Velcro? Double-sided tape? I'm wondering if vibrations can cause the HC hiccup! |
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Post by elkmaster01 on Jul 18, 2009 18:44:09 GMT -6
BTW,,,since I learned to fly Moat-Gator,,,,I have somewhere in the neighborhood of 70 to 80 flights. Other than two minor tail strikes and one hard landing on a flip'n invisible-rock, this was the first crash,,,,not bad,,,and that says a LOT about the Helicommand.
We won't talk about those freakish little demon 450 varments,,,I hate those. As soon as I get my 500 flying,,,,I'm gonna donate all my bent parts to someone!! ;D I just cannot get them rigged right.
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Post by lowbudget on Jul 18, 2009 20:22:57 GMT -6
elk are you talking about them 450 rockets - they are touchy and hairy to fly from what i have seen on video - what could someone do with your leftover 450 stuff ? - just wondering ;D = VIC
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McKrackin
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Post by McKrackin on Jul 18, 2009 22:19:57 GMT -6
Interesting experiment Elk. Mine reacts just the same as yours. I'm thinking time limit.Since it takes less than a second to level in actual flight,prolonged control input from the HC to the servos in one attitude will register as grounded.I'll bet this is why it's recomended that the HC be off in very active 3D flying.If the heli is never level for a long time it will quit trying. I've never flipped the switch in a maneuver. I usually only turn it off to do rainbows or tic tocs. Tried a rainbow yet?Cool as heck. Pull the nose up and back and when the heli is just starting to get inverted bust full negative and fly forward belly first till it starts to lose altitude then push forward on the nose until it's almost level then bust full positive and fly backwards rotor button first.Rinse and repeat ;D My HC is mounted inside the frame with Velcro as well as a zip tie around it and the frame.  |
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Post by elkmaster01 on Jul 19, 2009 6:23:17 GMT -6
Rainbow huh? I call it a "Tic ------------hmmm--------------la,,la,,la-----------Toc" ;D
I've tried them,,,but that was when I was having trouble holding the tail straight when cycling the collective. I tightened the spring on my Tx rudder stick so I can feel the rudder neutral better.
I've been practicing them on the Phoenix,,,,but, I start like you said,,,nose up and come back,,,but when I push forward,,at mid point do a half-roll so I finish both sides with the rotor out. I'm waiting to try that stuff on the 500. My tic-tocs on the 600 are getting way better. ;D
The Helicommand warns about doing stall turns because that will disturb the artificial horizon of the gyros.....I think that applies to normal flight too. If you do a hover with a strong nose wind for 10 seconds,,,then fly off down wind,,the HC will have a nose-down attitude. Even flying a long banked turn,,when you level off,,,,the HC hold at a tilt.
I'm playing with the gains and stick priority the next few flights,,,see if it can be tweeked better. You would think that a system this expensive would be able to establish an artificial horizon at initialization and hold it thru-out the flight,,,,that doesn't appear to be the case. I guess it uses sensors/accellerometers,,,,not actual gyros. That would take a larger/heavier system.
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Post by elkmaster01 on Jul 19, 2009 8:47:10 GMT -6
When did this thread start? You wrecked it and fixed it before I knew about it? ?? Tough break Elk. Glad it's back up though. You know,a Helicommand can lock out controls.... They need reset every now and then. I crashed it thursday and posted this thread on friday,,,,I had all the parts I need and was ready to fly on sat. Today,,Sunday,,,I just flew two packs and everything seems fine. I did two RAINBOWS!! Not bad at all. Ernie,,,,dude,,,,,you have to try some better blades than the Align CFs,,,,I'm forced to use my Radix blades right now and it makes for a whole new heli. Night and day!! I can only imagine this heli with that Neu motor and Radix blades,,,,OMG! I have great weather today and tomorrow,,,I'll fly as much as the charger will let me. I'm getting some good stick time with the HC off,,,good practice for the 500. I'm on hold with the 500 right now waiting on the scorpion ESC,,,they are mod' ing the new ones right now,,,they've had problems with spektrum systems, I should get one of the first upgraded ESC. I'm going to use the 90 amp 6-cell. |
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McKrackin
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Post by McKrackin on Jul 19, 2009 11:33:04 GMT -6
I'm going to get blades and paddles after I get more batteries.
I have a Turnigy 5000mAh 25C 6S enroute now.
Two was OK with the 500 since they charged in 45 minutes.I had three though.lol....
With these 5000's though,I'm charging for 2 hours and I'm going to need at least three.
I'm foregoing the 8S plans for now and looking towards nitro.I'd like to have a 700 but a 600 would mean many parts would be interchangable,soooo......
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) caused by metal and CF components on the aircraft. 
??