Kent's F-86 PR didn't fair as well!

[akent]

After posting this to 19k's thread, that didn't seem right, so I moved it here.

I am also very impressed with the quality of the plane and it's parts!

I received mine yesterday, put it together last night and maidened it today, too! It drew quite a bit of attention at the field! It's a very nice looking jet! Oh, and it's even painted! Those aren't stickers on there.

It was overcast here with intermittent rain and wind.

Mine did not fair as well as yours did, 19k!

I threw it underhanded at WOT. It stumbled and finally rose into the air. It is fast at WOT! I came around, and like 19k's it needed no aileron trim, but it needed down elevator (I had probably 10 clicks of up trim).
I had WAY too much aileron in there. The plans call for 7/16" max and I had about 2/3-3/4". The elevator had about that much, too.

Anyway, I was able to handle the quick ailerons and flew a few straight circuits around the field. It is beautiful in a low flyby!

I first stalled mine after a half throttle or so flyby, when turning to come back around. It basically started to fall out of the sky, suddenly. I was low, but at WOT I was able to get it under control. Man, that was sudden!
I did a few other passes and then tried a loop at probably 3/4 throttle. That was barely a loop. It fell out at the top and stalled big time into a spin. I was unable to save it this time.
I crashed fairly hard almost nose first and to the side.

It ripped one of the drop tanks off, and the impact ripped the plywood plate out inside the plane. It crushed the foam some on the nose, but not anything like you would think!

It is perfectly fixable.

Note to self: DO NOT try a loop in this thing at less than WOT. DO NOT do much of anything other than a straight flight at less than WOT.

I guess I was expecting this thing to fly like the Stryker!!

19k posted some nice pictures, so no need to post more.
Kent

All in all, it's amazing how light the damage was. I expected BAD.




This picture looks worse than it actually is. From 5 feet away, you can hardly tell!

[19000rpm]

Ouch. Well, at least it's repairable.

I guess I should have stressed not to try to fly this plane at low speed with more emphasis when we started talking about this on the Stryker thread. Sorry. It certainly is no Stryker or any high wing area modified delta.

Also, getting used to the slow response of the EDF takes some time too.

Anyway, I'm sure you'll have a lot of fun with it when you fly it in the future within its unique, for type, performance envelope.

BTW, if you get a Mig 15 it's going to fly exactly the same way. Not surprising, since we copied much of our F86 design from theirs.

[Gabe]

I wonder how spoilerons would fair on this plane for slow speed passes? I was actually watch RCPowers latest video on the Dynam F-16 and he discusses why spoilerons are the better choice for edf's over flaperons when landing.

Food for thought, Kent.

[19000rpm]

On an F16 they would work, but I'm almost positive on the F 86 they wouldn't work so well. There's only one way to know for sure...

[akent]

I think the problem with the F-86 that 19k and I have is that it's TOO much like the real thing.

If you read about the full size ones, they need speed to fly. When the speed is there, these things will turn on a dime and otherwise be incredible in the air. Mine was all of that when I kept the speed up. But it suddenly stalled when I was a dummazz on the speed stick.

From now on, if I keep it stock, it will be flying at half throttle during low passes, WOT or near WOT at all other times. This thing don't do slow well!

Of course, I only had one flight! And I stalled it TWICE.
Go fast with this model!
Kent

[19000rpm]

May 10, 2010 20:18:44 GMT -6 akent said:

I think the problem with the F-86 that 19k and I have is that it's TOO much like the real thing.

If you read about the full size ones, they need speed to fly. When the speed is there, these things will turn on a dime and otherwise be incredible in the air. Mine was all of that when I kept the speed up. But it suddenly stalled when I was a dummazz on the speed stick.

From now on, if I keep it stock, it will be flying at half throttle during low passes, WOT or near WOT at all other times. This thing don't do slow well!

Of course, I only had one flight! And I stalled it TWICE.
Go fast with this model!
Kent

Yes, very much like the real thing and it takes some adjustment in our flying style to take advantage of its attributes and avoid its pitfalls.

One other thing that makes this a little different than the other planes you've been flying, besides the relatively high stall speed, is the lag in thrust from the fan. It takes more time, and a greater increase in throttle position, for the fan to produce thrust than it does for a prop plane using the same amount of throttle, so it's easy to get behind the curve and end up with a stall with this plane. Any time I sense it's getting even a little bit close to unstable I give it WOT to make sure I get enough speed soon enough.

I found the plane glides fairly well, better than I expected, if the wings are kept level. It has a pretty fast sink rate, but as long as the wings are level and the nose is level it's very stable. I came in pretty hot and just chopped the throttle when I was about 20-25 ft from the ground about 75 yards out. It was still going fairly fast just before touch down. When I gave it a bit of flair it immediately slowed and settled. I love it.

[akent]

That's great info, 19k!! I have not fixed mine yet, but it looks to be a 10 minute job.
One thing is true, these things are very durable! Mine smacked pretty hard!

After witnessing a few composite EDF crashes, I am not sure I'll ever own one of those. They are just too fragile and EXPENSIVE. Last weekend, a fellow was flying one and the rubber wheel came off on takeoff. When he landed, the gear grabbed the pavement and it summersaulted. It was amazingly torn up from just that. If that had happened to the F-86, I don't think it would have hurt it at all other than a few scratches. His was almost totalled from that.

I like this size! It needs MORE power, though... I really like the way they did the fan on this jet. No glue is awesome! I think I'll install the HC 64mm fan setup I have to see if it has any more thrust...Somehow I think it won't be any better...
It is this one:
www.hobbycity.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=6632
Kent

[19000rpm]

I haven't been able to fly mine since Sunday due to the rain and wind. Looks like it is clearing Fri.

Yeah, that is a great paint job. It looks like enamel, but probably isn't. They must use some low stick mask to paint the stripes on without pealing up the base silver.

That's a nice price on the fan & motor at HK. I'm pretty sure it's going to have about the same performance since the specs are the same as the stock motor.

I don't know enough about EDF's to say what motor might be better. I do know that if you up the fan to a 67mm you're going to get more thrust. I think that doable

[akent]

The HK EDF motor is very similar to the F-86, but it is spec'd to run on 4s as well.
It also has 6 blades instead of five.

At this point, I will just fix mine and fly it stock for now.

I have a couple of other builds that I want to see finished first!

(EPP 1.3# flying go-cart (foam is cut out), EPP 1.9# Edge-540T (ready to fly), Stryker Dark (have foam and cover parts), Club Combat Plane (airframe finished), and a Depron Seaplane (foam is cut out), an HK-600 heli (need motor, ESC))

Too many projects and too little time!!! I'm working a million hours now, so that doesn't help.
Kent

[19000rpm]

4S. that would generate more performance for sure. Six blades? I missed that. I seem to recall reading less blades, like three, is better. I'm probably wrong though.