Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Feb 1, 2009 20:01:52 GMT -6
Introduction:
I really got into modding early in the 80's when, at 18, I got my first VW Bus. I haven't looked back since. When I first got my Belt CP from Xheli, I really thought I had something. It flew right out of the box. I had no idea what "set up" meant, but I got it in a sustained hover fairly quick. Until the oldest of my 4 children says "Hey dad, take it higher." I don't know why I felt the need to listen to someone who had just barely finished breast feeding, but my ego said "go ahead dude." It wasn't a bad crash as far as crashes go. The feathering shaft was bent and so was the main shaft. The wooden blades... well, they were toast.
I looked at the head and thought... "Oh my god." The parts were so small and there were so many of them. I had just spent $155 dollars on something I wouldn't be able to fly anymore. Little did I know the $155 is a laughable drop in the bucket. So I bought the Trex CNC Aluminum 450 head. It was listed as an upgrade for the Belt CP. I had no idea what I was buying, and like a monkey, I liked the shiny blue object in front of me. Thank god my primal instinct was correct, because that head is well put together.
So this started me off on modding this helicopter. I became an avid searcher for information. Through my search, I have found many great ideas. Some I felt that I could improve upon, some I've made my own. That's what this build is about. Making your ideas mine, and maybe making my ideas yours... sharing our information in a productive manner.
Even though this build is flying in its existing form, that doesn't mean that there is no room for improvement. I had this build on another forum, but because I felt "weird" about posting links on a commercial site to its competitors, I always held back a little.
I can't bring the whole thread over. That would mean posting someone else's comments in this thread, and that's a breach of trust. So, I'm going to bring the crux of the thread here and build on it. I am a very visual person. You can explain it a thousand times, but it wont mean much until I can see it. So, for that reason, I use a lot of pictures and videos in my threads.
Just to be clear, I am still learning. I don't break out the slide rule, or even care much about the math behind why helis fly. Some things are important to know, but how many winds in a particular motor isn't a high priority to me. I will try to use appropriate terms, but sometimes you might see odd names for something you know as a different name. Bear with me, please correct me (politely), and lets get our helis in the air with as little down time as possible.
This heli is no longer a Belt CP it is an HDX Super Frame with Trex 450 tendencies. I have used the boom of the Belt simply because I like the color, and the battery, but that's about it. Everything else is different. So different that, when I'm done here, I will be able to rebuild my Belt CP without having to buy much... but that's another thread.
Robby
[glow=red,2,300][shadow=red,left,300]HARD HAT AREA[/shadow][/glow]
Thread building in progress
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Doozer
Paint Staff
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Working on GP Ultimate Biplane
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Post by Doozer on Feb 2, 2009 2:45:45 GMT -6
[PSA] I want to start this build off by first saying the the ESKY ESC EK1-0350 is a very dangerous ESC. It is a known, well documented, fire starter. I have experience with this. This is why I'm telling you to change it out if you have it. You don't have to believe me, reasearch it yourself. You may have flown with it for a while, with nothing happening, but just know that it's a ticking time bomb. If you use this ESC, please do not use it where there is highly flammable objects. [/PSA] Ok... Here it goes. You can buy many frames to upgrade your Belt CP. The carbon fiber upgrade frame from ESKY is very nice. If you go this route, shop around, because on Xheli its $108 dollars and on Helidirect the same frame is $79. I've seen it elsewhere on sale in the high $40's. The difference in this frame and that is first, its not carbon fiber, its G-10 fiber and Aluminum... much stronger. Carbon fiber frames can sometimes mess with FM electronics. So if you are using a 72 mghz Tx you might have rethink whether you want to use carbon fiber. Second, the ESKY frame locks you into their servo configuration. This means a ton of linkage and the potential for slop and malfunctioning parts is greatly increased. The HDX super frame allows you link your servos directly to your swashplate. Plus, the HDX frame is wide enough to store most of your electroincs and wires on the inside the frame. This helps keep the CG well... in the center. The best part is the HDX frame is $55 dollars. It comes with extra screws as well (not a ton but a few). If you've ever put together an ESKY kit, you know that there is generally nothing extra. If you lose one you're out of luck. Here's pictures of the frame build:  Metal to metal, blue thread lock will keep your screws in place.  Kit from Helidirect $54 Super Frame  Spreading the Kit pieces out. The Superskids don't come with the kit, niether do the Microheli CNC Gears  The kit is made of Black G-10 and aluminum. Flat phillips head screws for the bottom and trays. Hex head for bolting the sides of the frame together.  Bottom of the frame with aluminum supports  Flat Phillips head screws secure the aluminum to the bottom  Same with the Battery tray and the secondary battery tray  Mounted the bottom and the shaft/servo supports to the side of the frame.  Notice the orientation of the bearings. Like most heli with this type of shaft support, exposed side of the bearing on top mount faces up , on the bottom mount the exposed side faces down.  Then I mounted the motor mount and boom mounts.    View from above    Frame complete Thank you to Finless Bob for the video. The kit is a bit different than the one he built and I had to do a little guess work. There are NO instructions at all except for the Finless videos, and the boom mounts have changed since his video. Also, I had to purchase a Trex 450 Belt tail pulley for this kit, and it is not the same one that is used in the Finless video. The pulley itself is press fit. They have changed the type/color of the screws, and added an aluminum bar to support the canopy supports. I will post more pics as the parts roll in. |
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Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Feb 2, 2009 11:42:23 GMT -6
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Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Feb 2, 2009 11:44:24 GMT -6
 4x Hitec HS55 servos @$14.00 US ea $56.00 US Total 1x Telebee/Zoom Head Lock Gyro with ATV $44.00 US 1x Just Go Fly 450 Outrunner Motor $56.00 1x Main Gear Tail Drive System Trex (106T) Superframe $14.00 US  I took this picture to put the size of the Gyro in perspective. It's very small. That's a frame screw out in front.  Originally I was going to go with the Microheli gears... I still might... I probably should since I've paid $60 dollars for the set.... but I decided to start with the suggested gears for this frame. I'll use the Microheli gears if these get blown out.  Before I changed out the zip ties  Everything but the canopy  Closer view  Belt tail gear and pulley. |
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Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Feb 2, 2009 11:48:39 GMT -6
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Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Feb 2, 2009 11:50:39 GMT -6
I moved my Control link Balls on the inside of the Control arm. I used a trick I learned from The "Ball_Links101" Finless video. Muuuuuch better. Here's some pics:  Before  After  Just about as perfectly straight as you can get  The pics a little fuzzy, but it shows how close it is after I shaved it down. Wouldn't work otherwise. |
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Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Feb 2, 2009 11:58:47 GMT -6
[edit Feb.02] at this point in the build I was having some serious tail issues. I couldn't get a grasp on what was going on. The Gyro was brand new, so that was the last thing that I thought was wrong. [/edit] The new carbon boom I ordered is shorter by about half an inch  I'll just cut that down and use it for a spare on my Xeon. I've ordered 4 HYPERION ATLAS DS 09 AMD (HP-DS09AMD) FULLY PROGRAMMABLE DIGITAL SERVOs. 3 for the 450 cyclic and 1 for the Xeon tail. I also ordered Logictech 2100T Gyro + 3100G Servo Combo Set for the 450 tail. They should be here in a few days. Let me tell you, the price of this build just went way up. After I get my 550/600 class, I'm done with new kits for a while. I'll be living in a box surrounded by my helis if I'm not careful. The FRP blades are cool but nothing like I expected. I expected something similar to the Extreme FRP blades that I purchased for my HBFP/Neon. The FRP blades from Extreme have the plastic on the outside and a strip of fiberglass running the length of the blade on the inside. These new 325 mm blades have an extremely smooth finish on the outside... I'm not sure what the material is, but they look to have the black plastic strip sandwiched in the middle instead of having the black plastic on the outside. Anyway heres a link... www.helidirect.com/product_info.php?cPath=117_120_463_561&products_id=3153 I'm pulling the carbon blades off until I'm finished testing and dialing in the tail. I'll post some pics later. For now, both builds are on hold with a new kit (Trex 250) expected today or Monday. |
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Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Feb 2, 2009 12:01:29 GMT -6
[edit Feb. 02] This post was from yesterday in the other forum [/edit] Up in the air!!! How, you might ask? Well, last night while on the throne of contemplation, I decided that I had done every possible thing I could do for the tail... and done them again. Including adjusting the gain and the end points, and also switching between A and B reversing modes. I also put an 8g digital servo from the Belt CP on the tail. I have to say, that servo is much better than the 9G Tower Pro analog. Anyway, I couldn't fathom that the brand new (I hope) Telebee Gyro from Helidirect was bad. I had to try though. So I clipped all the wire ties, unplugged the gyro, and slapped on the old rate gyro from the Belt CP. Here is the result: I threw away the box for the Telebee. So, I guess I'm stuck with it. I always keep every box, for a while anyway, but this time I was just confident that there wouldn't be an issue. I'm going back to keeping every box  I love it when a plan comes together. |
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Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Feb 2, 2009 12:42:08 GMT -6
Here's some more photos:  Servo to swash placement. This is before I move the control link balls to the inside. Just wanted to give you and idea of where the servos are placed.  Trex CNC Tail with Trex tail blades.  FRP 325mm Blades  Side View of the blades  Top View of CNC Tail   Shows the wiring as it is now. Since I'm getting new servos and a new Gyro this will change. |
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Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Feb 6, 2009 23:46:40 GMT -6
Got my Logictech Gyro and digital tail servo combo in store.rcsupersales.net/servlet/-strse-2311/Logictech-2100T-Gyro--pls-/Detail its not that price now ... its the deal of the week. I think its around $130 dollars. Its shorter in height than the Telebee and maybe a little bigger at the base... not much though. I was surprised at its size for sure. The manual is not much bigger than the Gyro... no kidding. Reminds me of the old Cracker Jack days (when the prizes were really kind of cool). I'll post a picture of it later. I want to fly some tomorrow. I've been building and modding a bunch lately and not been doing much flying (except for the occasional test hover). Anyway, I'll put up a video with the new tail servo and gyro as soon as I get it on. [Edit wee mornign hours]   If you know how small the telebee is you have a great reference for how small the Logictech gyro is .... and the manual. Break out the 2.5's  |
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Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Feb 8, 2009 11:13:47 GMT -6
My servos should be here any day now. I called Kyle @ rcsupersales.com and he's sending me some different servos. The Hyperion AMD's were out of stock. He did send me my Logictech Gyro and digital tail servo. I wanted to throw up some pictures and a brief explanation on programming the gyro.  This is the new gyro. I had a Telebee on there but no matter what setting I had it on it just wouldn't work. So I decided that I wasn't going to cheap this heli out anymore. I purchased the Logictech LGT 2100T (Gyro) & LTS-3100G (Servo) combo from RC Supersales. I didn't get in on the sale, but that always seems to be the case for me. As of the date of this post it's one of his weekly specials.  This gyro is programmable. However, you must have mastered the language of Broken English to understand the manual. The manual is also Teenie Weenie. I mean small. I broke out the magnifying glass to read it. I would be cool if there was a card like there is for ESC's, but you have to push the button and use left stick input from your radio. It's really not that much of a pain.
Once I got a grip on the language they were trying to speak, I figured out how to program the gyro. To get it to "Auto Search" for your brand of radio, with your radio on you unplug the power from your heli then plug it back in. You then quickly give left rudder from your radio. This sends the gyro into search mode. I use a Spektrum DX6i so, it didn't recognize my radio and went into generic mode. Not a big deal, this happens a lot with many of the new programmable electronics.
If you hold that little white button for a for a few seconds, the gyro will go into programming mode. You must use the manual to coordinate the programming of your gyro. It comes with default settings and those setting will not work for the digital tail servo combination. I had to change them from standard to digital servo, I left the direction alone. I also left the rotation speed alone, and set the servo limits. The rotation speed comes default as slow. This means your piro rate is going to be slower. When I tested piros it was fast enough for how I'm flying at the moment.
All this programming is done by coordinating stick input and button presses with the numbers/lights at the top of the gyro. It can be a little confusing if you've never programmed a gyro before or if you have no experience with programming this particular gyro. The Align 750 was a ton easier, but I don't want this to sound like a monster to program because it wasn't.  I used this horn. It fit the best.  Mounted in the same place. I'm really going to have to look for some documentation that gives me some push-rod lengths. After building the little Align, then flying it, I can see the value in that.  I have new servos coming so I didn't spend a ton of time wiring this. The key to wiring is making sure that Mr. Murphy doesn't show up while flying. Anything that can go wrong will go wrong, and it will be at the most inconvenient time imaginable (Murphy 101). So tie your wires down and out of the way of moving parts or your heli will fall out of the sky. I do like to try and keep it neat, but there's no real point, as this is not the final product. |
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Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Feb 14, 2009 22:01:02 GMT -6
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Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Feb 15, 2009 23:22:02 GMT -6
Here is the finished Heli.
Another inside hover video I made after the Hyperion Servo and Logictech Tail installation.
Show this to your wives. Tell them its safe to hover inside.
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Doozer
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Post by Doozer on Mar 11, 2009 22:05:46 GMT -6
I moved the servos around, and changed how the servos interacted with the swashplate. I remeasured all the links and went with the recommended set up. I had this heli flying well, I was just never really comfortable with the resolution of the servos. I will take some pics, and get a test hover before my tx goes out for repair.... I'm still waiting on the label from Horizon.
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I'll just cut that down and use it for a spare on my Xeon. I've ordered 4 HYPERION ATLAS DS 09 AMD (HP-DS09AMD) FULLY PROGRAMMABLE DIGITAL SERVOs. 3 for the 450 cyclic and 1 for the Xeon tail. I also ordered Logictech 2100T Gyro + 3100G Servo Combo Set for the 450 tail. They should be here in a few days. Let me tell you, the price of this build just went way up. After I get my 550/600 class, I'm done with new kits for a while. I'll be living in a box surrounded by my helis if I'm not careful. 
