HBFP Upgrade To Guru-Z Neon / Xeon

[Doozer]

Sol,
Heres a link to mings post about the 400 FP. The whole thread is interesting. Variable Pitch FP? Doesn't that not make it fixed anymore... anyway... here it is:

www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11189657&postcount=67

2/3 of the way down on his reply: "But there will be a 400FP coming as well!"

Still at work... I'll post more later.

[Solitaire]

You know, I read that post by Ming last month. It just didn't register, I guess. I think the "dog fight" remark confused me.

[Doozer]

I'm waiting on batteries to charge So I thought I'd post the build pics from the Xeon frame.


If you have trouble, or don't understand something, you can go to the Guru-Z website and download the directions. Because I don't have a computer by my bench I printed these out. My son later reminded me I could use my Ipod Touch


Start off with either side of the frame... doesn't matter which as long as you have the tail facing the right way.


you can put the bearing mount in two ways... one way is wrong.


The 5mm Xeon kit comes with a plastic belt guide. The 3mm comes with no belt guide because it comes standard with a 5mm boom mount. Confused yet? I was too. But after opening two tabs and flipping back and forth between the two, I bought the 5mm shaft kit. Wrong answer! I should have gone with the 3mm and bought a boom mount and guide. Oh well. Anyway, this metal guide was an extra purchase. Is it necessary?... I don't think so. Do I think it will last longer and be more efficient? Yep! But if you're running on a budget, you can do without this.


These screws really gave me some grief


12mm boom mount


Boom mount attached to the frame


Before you put the other side on, its a lot easier to go ahead and mount the Aileron servo. The servo requires a bolt. The screw is not self tapping. So rather than try to stand on your head and put the servo in later. Go ahead and do it now.


Because I use a 450 motor its a bit larger than the standard brushless motor. Also if you use a 450 motor, you'll need to lengthen the mount hole on the gear side of the mount so that the pinion will mesh with the gear.


Mounting the other side of the fiber frame. Notice... leave those two holes on the frame open... that's where the servo goes. If not, you'll be unscrewing them later.


Here's a tip that nobody else has... at least that I know of. This is a 1/16th hand drill bit. After I literally bent screws on the fiber frame, and punched a hole in my finger with the screwdriver, I started predrilling every hole. If I would have done this first, I could have probably gone without the extra screw pack.... maybe. Buy it just in case. You may need it later.


Another view


adding the part of the frame.


Front of the frame complete




Stock skids. They look like them... but not hardly. I'll use them until they break then I'll put the Super Skids on.


Side by side Neon / Xeon. This is the only reason I am switching frames. I want to rewire, and put co-pilot on the Xeon. The Neon was just too small to do this.


Depending on what servos you use ... you may have to grind out a little more room. Right now I'm using 9g Tower Pros and they are just a touch tight.

[Doozer]

Well I did it. I drilled a hole into a 80mm HBFP 3mm shaft to fit the metal hub. Its a bit of a process, but really not that difficult if you take good care. If you have a drill press, this would be cake. I don't. I used a mini gun. I first drilled out the existing hole in the shaft with a 1/16th bit so the 5/64" bit wouldn't jam up. The hole on the Extreme shaft that came with the metal head is a little bigger than 5/64" So the 5/64" bit leaves the hole a hair smaller than the bolt, and the bolt actually taps into the metal of the shaft. With some threadlock you don't need a nut. I put it on anyway. But before I could actually get the hub on the shaft I had to clean away the burrs. I did this with my Dremel and a grinding disk. I used a polishing wheel as well so that when I bend a shaft again it won't be such a PITA to pull the hub off the shaft.

I've found that the metal hub is worth having if you use the Extreme blade grips. So... I'm tearing this thing apart... again. Once I get it air worthy and all dialed in I'll be putting co-pilot on it.

[Doozer]

Another setback I'm a mutant! I totally forgot to screw in the servo horn on my brand spankin' new Hyperion Digital tail servo. store.rcsupersales.net/servlet/-strse-4534/HYPERION-ATLAS-DS-09/Detail?sfs=38d22be8

I haven't taken it apart yet , but it caught on fire and burned a hole in the case from binding. This poor heli has caught on fire twice now. This time was my fault though... The servo horn got stuck and couldn't move. It even made my ESC heat up.

I think my motor is dying as well, or I have a bad solder somewhere. I've been wanting to change it out anyway. I've wanted to put a Scorpion in it, so I think I'm going to do that. For now though, I'm going to throw the old Guru-GE brushless motor back in. I'll have to deal with less torque I also will be putting a Logictech 2100t Gyro and 3100 tail servo on it. I'm changing out the cyclic servos to these store.rcsupersales.net/servlet/-strse-1147/WAYPOINT-PRECISION-SUB-dsh-MICRO-9.2/Detail?sfs=38d22be8 I have one and another one is coming with the 600 kit.

I guess I could really bling it out with some Hyperions but I think that would be overkill. So.... I'm really leaving a parts trail with this one.

I would have been fine if I hadn't forgotten to screw in my servo horn!!!

[Solitaire]

Finally got the proper link for the new DX metal tail. Hooked it all up and thought I'd test it out and set up the gyro/tail.

Something is seriously wrong with my DX6i setup. The whole reason for changing the tail to the metal one (besides the plastic being crappy) was the plastic tail got creamed when the heli spooled up full RPM with the Tx throttle down.

Well it did it again. I had spooled it up to check setup and went for a small screwdriver to adjust the gyro, throttle down, Neon on the kitchen floor. Turned my back and all of a sudden the thing spooled up on its own. Tore off the new blades, dented the boom, bent the main shaft, broke the rotor core, and trashed the new tail. Pieces strewn all over the kitchen.

All this after I had just spent two hours installing the servos in the new EXI and chasing small pieces all over the place. Installing balls on those servos is a job for someone with a lot more patience than me.

Needless to say, after the Neon issue (for the second time), I was pissed. I need a holiday. Or a different hobby.

[Doozer]

I've got an extra red boom and skids Sol, If you need it let me know... I've got spares out the wazoo. I'm still using the original with the blade strike dents. Sounds to me like you need to check your throttle curve and if that's ok, check the throttle trim, and sub trims. If they're ok... check the polarity of the ESC on the rx. If that's ok.... i don't know... another rx maybe. Hang in there man. Trying using a table clamp to hold your heli down.

If its any consolation, I'm struggling with my Xeon.... I get three minutes of flight then battery drain. I put an extra tooth on the pinion. Thank god I didn't jump to 13!!

[Solitaire]

Thanks Doozer. I've straightened out the boom (minor dent and bend) and the skids are fine. I've all the repair parts in stock except another metal tail (on it's way from DX)

Throttle curve checked. Trim down. No sub trim. ESC/Rx appears to be working as I've run it up a few times in the kitchen, checking balance. It's weird and it's scary.

What's with only 3 mins of flight time on the Xeon? Iffy battery? Main gear and/or belt too tight? Are you using the Esky 1800mAh on that thing?

[Doozer]

yep that's an 1800 mah 20C battery. 3min. The motor and ESC are really hot too. Adjusting the meshing with the Xeon frame and the Microheli gear is a PITA. I'm going to have to make the holes bigger in the gear. I was at a 9t pinion with the Guru-Z motor before, but I jumped to an 11t this time. My results are less than scientific since I made multiple moves. I tried the old ESC too. That could be my problem. I had problems with it before, but I can't remember what they were. As you know, my thread got deleted on rc discuss

So... even though this will be a pain, I'm going to take off the Guru-z (Hobbywing) ESC and put the Waypoint on. I took the Waypoint off because the ESKY motor was working intermittently. I wasn't exactly positive that the motor was dying but it made sense. However, the ESC did heat up to pretty hot when the tail servo bound up. That's why I took the Waypoint ESC off. So I kind of have a mess here. I changed out the motor, and ESC and added another two teeth to the pinion, and it could also be the meshing. I'm not sure if it would just be easier to scrap all the electronics and the motor and start over. But... what fun would that be?

[Doozer]

My work on this heli is on hold until after the 600 is built and in the air. But I'm waiting to see video of your heli flying/hovering Sol!!! PM me if you need any parts. I'll get them in the mail straight away.

[dubehigh]

nice job sol, i realy like it. i orderd the neon frame with the belt boom, seeing your thread helps alot. thanks for taking the time to do that.

[Solitaire]

No credit due here dube. This is Doozer's baby. He's the one with all the time spent putting this thread together. I just whine at him from time to time.

Doozer...my flying abilities are even worse than my building abilities...and you can see the results of my building a couple of posts back.

[Doozer]

That's ok... that's why this is one tough little bird. You get a ton of credit here too Sol. Don't sell yourself short. You are a major contributor to this thread, and I've taken your advice on more than a few occasions.

Thanks again!

[dubehigh]

cheers to both you guys. you have both helped me alot. if it wasnt for guys like you and mc with all the time in this hobby. i would just be a drunken puddle in a lost pool of sh#t

[Doozer]

Got a new motor and ESC coming from RC Super Sales. Will take pics once its installed.

store.rcsupersales.net/servlet/-strse-1488/4500KV-Brushless-Outrunner-Motor/Detail?sfs=977a4598

store.rcsupersales.net/servlet/-strse-2339/WayPoint-25A-Brushless-ESC/Detail?sfs=977a4598

When that digital servo caught fire the ESC got very hot. I tried it with a different motor same behavior. My bad..... anyway. I didn't over do it here. I want to go 4S with this to supply enough power for the Co-Pilot.